CORINNE BOBROW-WILLIAMS ON BEAUTY, LIBERATION & WHY WE SHOULD TALK ABOUT MONEY MORE

PHOTOS BY Isaac Taylor Shane ★ WORDS BY William O’Neal Ii

Photo By: Isaac Taylor Shane

I recently had the honor of sitting with the multi-hyphenate and gentle-spirited Corinne Bobrow-Williams on a sunny day in Bedstuy. We grabbed a tea from September Café and sat on a stoop, talking for hours about their beginnings in photography, posing feminine bodies in front of recycled backdrops, how the South informed the way they see the world at large, the beauty of being Black, and the exploitative nature of money. Corinne’s presence and the gems of wisdom they left with me during our conversation were the breaths of fresh air I needed on an otherwise sweltering Tuesday. I hope you find the same.

WILLIAM: Hi Corrine, thank you for being here with me. I want to start with the question we always begin with – what is one piece of advice you want to give to Black creatives around the world?

CORINNE: Take your time. It's really important for us as creators to know that it's not a race. It's okay to go at a pace that feels right to you, no matter where you're at in terms of location, because, we get in the habit of wanting to match the energy or the speed of where we're at location-wise, and it's okay not to do that. It's okay to be at a pace where it's like, I can be going at this pace and still, get things done and still feel fulfilled in these things I'm doing, no matter how much time it takes. You know? That's important when we're creating good work. When you're creating good work, good work takes time and dedication, and failure and continuing, trying again and seeing what works, seeing what doesn't work. Because that's the whole whole point of creating, you know, is unlearning and doing things again, figuring out what works best. So, yeah, I think that's the best advice I could give.

Yeah definitely. Do you think it’s easy to get caught up in the fast-paced way of being with the inability to slow down in New York, specifically for creatives?

Yeah, of course. I think that's why I'm saying this, to a point where I feel, because we're in New York. Creators in New York feel that they have to be in that fast environment all the time. It's easy to get caught up in that, yes, but it's your awareness of when you're in it, how you respond to it, you know. What are you doing to balance? Have balance in your life, with work, with creative endeavors, with personal life, with businesses, how are you balancing your time? How do you balance what you want to do based on what you are supposed to do? Sometimes you have to separate the two, and sometimes you have to make money. And you know that's, that's OK, I feel like I'm learning that more now. I'm also learning that I can be in spaces that honor what I do and I get paid for it, yeah? So I think it really depends on what we see ourselves doing, and we what we manifest for ourselves. I have friends in corporate settings. I have friends that aren't in that setting at all, and I feel the conversations I've had are more so just around what are we? What are we honoring for ourselves? What do we specifically want to be doing every day? You know? So I think that's important to think about when you're in a space like New York, where it's over overcrowded, so many people overpopulated, congested, you know, and also taking time to yourself be a caught up in the idea of having to be around people all the time. It's the FOMO, you know, we feel like we're afraid of missing out on something. I've been in a space where I’ve been spending a lot of time doing inner work so that when I'm in a space [full of people], I can fully be myself, able to have good conversations and you know, be fully in my body.

That’s so good. Are you an introvert or an extrovert?

I’m an ambivert. I feel like I’m both. I like being by myself. I love community. I love being around people. I love conversation, I love talking. And that's my duality for myself. That's why I think balancing is important because, like, yes, it's important to also be in community. So I've been trying to focus more on that and knowing that things have divine timing. I know I'll be in the right places at the right time with the right people.

Where are you from?

I’m from Augusta, GA originally. I’ve been in New York for 3 years now, this will be my 4th. I’ve been here since 2020.

And how do you define yourself as an artist? I hate that question, so I will re-phrase it like this: what are you drawn to right now in this moment?

I'm drawn to things that bring me peace. I do photography, and I do creative direction, art direction, all these things that make me happy. I didn't go to school for photography, but I went to school for fashion, and the fact that I went to school and got to learn different things while I was there, I was able to enjoy the process of understanding different aspects of what the fashion industry had. And I wasn't just sewing, I was also doing art direction. You got to play different roles. And I got to be a stylist. I got to be a director, and assistant photographer. I feel like I've always been drawn to diversity and spaces where I know how to do somebody else's role. Because it came to a point where I had to be in somebody else's place. I know what to do. It's like survival. Somebody entered and you know what to do. I can be of service. I feel like being of service is important when it comes to creativity in general, because we know multiple things. We are able to understand everybody else's role and being of service in those spaces where somebody might not even understand what their role is. I think I've been drawn to just honing in on creativity and a sense of community. Most of the people I've photographed have been my friends, and I've done certain brand things, certain things with friends or companies that I've met through friends. I've done things that have to do with food. I've been really connected with food more. I think food and agriculture are really important when you're thinking about the grand scheme of everything, like, everything is connected. I think I am drawn to how things are connected in different creative spaces. For example, florists, stylists, photographers, and chefs, are all connected. And I'm in these spaces where I get to be around all these people. There's a chef, so there's going to be dinner, there's going to be a florist, and there is going to be a photographer, taking photos of all the flowers. There's going to be people enjoying the food.  So I think everything in that sense is connected. And that's what community is about, you know, being able to know somebody else’s strengths and then helping somebody with their weaknesses. A weakness is only there when somebody else isn't showing you what your weaknesses are so you can strengthen them. So I think being around people who are aware of your weaknesses who not only want to highlight your strengths, you can evolve yourself and you know, make changes. I think the people around us are doors to opportunities for us. You need people that open doors for you. I'm drawn to that, I’m drawn to community. How can we help each other? You know, how can we be of service to each other? I think that's what I've been drawn to the most.

So what are your weaknesses and how does the community that surrounds you right now help you with that?

So I have ADD. it's been like something I've been dealing with for a while now, because there's some things that I might miss, you know, and I feel, if I'm not paying attention fully, and somebody else around me is, they can highlight those weaknesses that I may have missed. For example, if you're living in New York and you forget to do something, and somebody realizes, they tell you, “Oh, you forgot to do that.” Make sure you do it. Do it next time. That person is aware of your weaknesses. We’re all like this. We're not gonna remember, sometimes, we're not gonna know what was right in the moment. But the people that are holding us accountable for those things are people that truly care for us. I feel like my weaknesses are only there because I'm surrounded by people who understand that about me. It's all about mindfulness. You know, the practice of mindfulness is what I've been talking to friends about all the time like we all have our things. Everybody has their thing. So it's surrounding yourself with people that acknowledge those things about you and shed light on them. You know, if somebody's not holding you accountable do they really care for you?  So, I think it's important for you to be surrounded by people that are honest and sincere, and want the best for you and want to see you at your best. I think that it's important when we’re talking about, like, what we're capable of doing in a space. Because I feel like even with Isaac, working with Isaac has always been so fluid. I think he's one person that I'll work with, and I never have to stress about what my role was, never have to stress about who I'm working with. Everything always went smoothly in the room, because things are communicated. People were honest and sincere about things from the beginning. That way we can just create in the moment and create what we want fluidly.

Tell me about Ubique.

Yeah, so it's so crazy, because this all, like, my whole thing started in college. I took an organic photography class. I took intermediate and then advanced, and my teacher kept making me come back and be in the advanced class. So through that, I was able to cultivate my own type of photography essence. At first, it was called Corinne Worldwide. And I was like, wait, I can have another word that means that, but a shorter version. So I was researching one day. During college, I was kind of putting together a website, for a class where we had to create a portfolio and showcase it. When it came to me moving to New York, I was like, I want to elevate this. Ubique means omnipresence. Omnipresence is something that I want to be, I want to capture in my day-to-day life. The reason why I chose to start was because everywhere I go, I want to be able to create magic and create something meaningful no matter where I'm at. New York and London and Africa, wherever, like, if I'm traveling, I can still create beautiful things. And, you know, it can be like a worldwide presence, like omnipresence. So I feel like Ubique was just a way of explaining what all that means more shortly. I think it's important for us to really dive into like, what brings us the most joy? Because I feel like life is very short, and we need to be living it very much, for us, for ourselves and for other people. I came up with that name, and now it's really stuck with me more. I love being able to showcase what it means to other people because it's such a word that people don't really know. So I think it's so fun when I'm able to research and find things that kind of relates to who I am. That's a part of me and my identity.

I stalked you a little bit. Your website says that you are a “multi-dimensional, creative person.” What dimension are you currently existing in?

That's such a hard question. I feel like, when people say they're a multi-dimensional creative, that just means that I'm not putting myself in a box. You know, I feel like, especially being in New York, we all do similar things. I have so many friends who are photographers. I have so many friends who make videos. I have so many friends with that style. But one thing I will say about each one of them, we all have different ways of doing [those] things. We all have our own unique presence, and that's what makes it special when we're creating, because we are able to really learn from each other, and I love that. That's why I love people like Isaac because it's important to cultivate spaces where we all can do what we love and bounce ideas off of each other, create meaningful things, and give back to one another, without the infusion of competition. That's where it's hard. That's where it goes wrong a lot of times, because we want to see our peers as competition more than someone that we can work with and create beautiful things. That's what stops a lot of us from being able to be in community. A lot of my friends make beautiful work. I love them for their work, and they love me for my work. But that does not mean that we have to diminish each other or tear each other down. I think it's important for us to have these conversations about what that looks like. What does a non-competitive environment look like in the creative scene? How can we create more spaces that are open to trial and error, that are open to us being vulnerable with each other? Because a lot of things [art] are based off of us having trauma. So it's really about creating safe and secure environments where we are able to have these conversations that maybe we have not had for a long time because nobody's willing to do it. You know, it’s uncomfortable, and a lot of us don't like being uncomfortable. It’s okay to be uncomfortable. That's why we are here, to be uncomfortable and have these tough conversations especially when it comes to the livelihood of our community, especially people of color.

What did your creative life look like when you were younger? Let's say middle school. You're in Augusta, Georgia, you're in the South. What did that look like?

My creative life when I was younger was carefree. When I was young, I was painting. I was using my dad's camera, taking photos. My parents took photos of me and my siblings my whole life, which I'm so grateful for. A lot of times, I'll see friends that don’t have any pictures of their childhood, and it's just so important to capture memories. My mom still has little art pieces I did when I was a kid. I can look back, and I'm like, Oh, I really was painting. That's why I love to paint during my free time because it was a thing I did when I was a kid. Not because I want to be a painter or, like, I’m Picasso or anything, but it’s because this is something that brings me joy and it's therapeutic for me. Art is therapy. I think during that time, when I was young, I was able to fully be in that creative mindset, without the competition, without thinking about what people thought about my work. Like, you know, as a kid, you're not even thinking about those things, you know, you're just like, Oh, I'm just creating. I'm just having a good time. Like, this is my life. But as an adult, it's like, okay, now I'm creating for this or that. Now, I gotta make sure people like what I’m creating. But we don’t have to do that. We can still have that inner child in us when it comes to creating because that's where creativity is sparked. The more imaginative you are about your reality and what you can create, the more you're capable of, because you're sitting in that mindset of like, okay, I can do these things without having to put so much pressure on myself.  Like if somebody’s going to buy this that’s good but they don’t have to. So I feel it’s important for us to do things that are for us and not for spaces where we want to gain anything. It’s one thing to want people to buy your work, and acknowledge that your work is good, but it's another thing to get it showcased, and then people see it, and then they're like, okay, this person enjoys this, and you can see that in their work. And for me, I'd rather have that than somebody like be like, Oh, I'm paying for your work. To me, it's not about money, because the relationship you have with money is only based off your own experiences, you know? And the conversation around money has only gotten so difficult to talk about. Community is so fragile. People will not let you use their resources, because they want to gate-keep and keep it for themselves. And I'm like, That makes no sense because if you cared about somebody's creative process, you would let them use the resources. You would let them have access to stuff. I think the people I'm surrounded with are trying to create that right now. I feel like that's been my struggle: not having the resources I want to create certain things. I'm very much a use what I have kind of person. Like, I have one camera, I don't have that many lenses, but I still create beautiful things. And that's kind of like how I grew up. I always utilized what I had around me. It's a beautiful way of living when you're not so tied up in the, you know, materialistic things.

I’m so glad you mentioned money because I wanted to ask you about that. Why do you feel it’s so scary for some people to talk about?

I feel like in school we weren't taught how to utilize money in the right ways. I have a friend with more knowledge about this. He was talking about financial literacy. You know, how growing up, some people needed money and some people had money already, so they didn't have to work for it. People that have to work for money, that’s a different relationship. Once somebody has money, you can see what money can do for your life, it changes the game. Money does change people and money can make people act differently. But also, money can create resources. Money can bring happiness to people. Money can change someone's life. Because our society is based on colonialism we feel the need to hone in on money more. I feel if we're going to talk about community and talk about money, it's like, what are we doing to give back to the people that need it the most? Because if you got it, then you have it. You don't have any worries. You know, people that don’t have it every day, have to worry about what their next day is going to look like. So, yeah, I think more community discussions about money and how we all can support each other are important to have. What are we going to do to help us gain the financial literacy we all want and need in our communities? I feel like we need to be talking about land and how we can acquire more like we don’t even talk about that anymore. As a Black person, as a person of color, having land is the most precious thing you can have. You can grow your own food. If that were the case, capitalism would be nonexistent. Capitalism is the idea of People taking resources and utilizing those resources to make money off of them, capitalizing off of things as simple as a tomato or herbs. Herbs are the natural healers. But then they want to create medicine that slowly kills us, that slowly dismantles our bodies, and knowing that if we had more knowledge about how herbs were the natural solution to healing our bodies then we wouldn't even be giving our money to any of these Companies. Consider Palestine, because of all these things happening in the world. Why are we still giving money to these places that aren't even aware of our personal situations? I think it's important for us to know exactly what we're putting our money into. At the end of the day, all we have is each other.

Who or what are your 3 biggest inspirations right now?

I would say my mom, my friends, honestly all of my friends are my biggest inspirations. They are reflective of who I am. I know a lot of people talk about celebrities, but I’m kind of not about that mentality, especially because I don’t know them or know who they are so I can’t relate to them the way I want to. But for me, I know my friends, I know who they are. I know my family, they all inspire me every day. I think we should have more conversations around that rather than celebrity culture. It’s starting to get to a point where we aren’t able to think for ourselves anymore because we are so consumed with the next celebrity thing happening. It’s like what about you, what about your life, and what’s going on in your life? We need to talk about who pours into your community. I mean I do like Kehlani, some of these celebrities are really for the culture and I feel like she is. But at the same time, you can’t fully rely on that. You have to rely on what’s in front of you.

Do you remember the first photo you took? The most memorable one? An image you can’t get out of your head?

I would say in college, a photo I took that I admired, in my dorm room, I was supposed to have a roommate but I didn’t. So I used the second room as a studio. I found this plastic material that I found at school in the film department and used it as a backdrop. I told my friend Courtney that we should do a shoot. I took some pictures of her, showcasing body features, not fully nude, but that shoot was so beautiful. I went to an all-women’s college, so I was always able to work closely with all of the women I was surrounded by. To this day we are all still friends and I keep those creative experiences very dear to me. I was able to capture another woman's beauty and essence. I feel like that was the beginning of me understanding that I loved being around nurturing energy. Having to really hone in on feminine energy and being there for each other was cool. I was able to capture so many of my friends’ beauty. It was so timeless, and it just worked.

What does liberation and beauty look like to you in the context of Blackness?

I like that question. I feel like when people are able to be unapologetically themselves, and then someone is able to capture that. Beauty, to me, is someone who can look past all of the structures and standards of what they’ve come to be. I would never change my body or my face because I love who I am. But I know some people feel like they have to change [their appearance] because of insecurities. Insecurities are brought onto us as a child. In terms of loving who you are in your Blackness and embracing your natural beauty— it is so important.  It [beauty] is not just features, it’s also energy, how you treat people, how you care for or consider somebody else. There are different ways to be beautiful and your spirit is really what makes you beautiful. How you show up in the world, how you show up for people, especially those that you care about. Looks are tricky because in our society now, we have so many different beauty standards, it’s hard to keep up with. You can’t. It’s hard to be truly who you are without trying to fit in. What is putting on all of this makeup doing for me? Is it making me feel better about myself? We have to ask ourselves what this is doing for us. Is it fully changing who I am or changing the way I am showing up in the world? For me, makeup is about culture. Makeup is so different between cultures, and many have been doing this for centuries, especially in Africa. These imprints and marks are traditions that we’ve had for years and are things that mean something to us. They are now becoming traditions that are changing over time. I think my version of beauty is enhancing the features I already have but also paying tribute to my ancestors in a way that feels right for me. When I had eyebrows, it didn’t always feel right for me. I used my face and makeup as a canvas. You can capture beauty and essence in that way.

Give me your one-sentence definition of liberation.

The act of being fully in your own body without the need to dim your light for anyone else, the act of feeling safe and feeling joy. Liberation is sacred. 

Do you have any regrets in your life?

Hmm, nope. I don’t. I don’t have any regrets.

What’s next for you in your creative journey?

I feel like I am in a space now where financial literacy is common in my orbit of life. Also, being able to explore more of myself in the spaces I’m in, and continue to build creative community through my work. Being satisfied with where I’m at and being present, knowing that things are going to continue to evolve.

Ok, last question. How can we create more spaces of representation, inclusivity, and diversity of Black / POC creatives in fashion, art, music, photography, dance online and across the world?

First, I think we need to create a space where we can think for ourselves. Know that it’s okay to think differently from people and have different perspectives and be OK with that. This brings us closer together. When we can have open discussions around what needs to change, we can create more environments that are thought-inducing, about the ways we show up in the world. Calling out shit that needs to be called out and holding people accountable for their actions. The only reason people aren’t okay with being sincere and honest is because they don’t feel like they are in a safe space. What are we doing to create safe spaces? The world is not looking pretty right now, the things that are happening in Congo and Palestine could happen to us. What would we do? What are the solutions and what can we do to prevent us from losing ourselves in the process of trying to change things? Coming together as a community to discuss what needs to be done is most important. How can we be here for each other?

Thank you so much Corinne for sitting here with me, today. Last thing, what is your sign and what are your pronouns?

I’m a Sagittarius and my pronouns are they/she.

It’s been a pleasure!